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Poll Do You Support The People Of Palestine?

Discussion in 'Foreign Affairs' started by maxflinn, Nov 2, 2015.

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Do You Support The People Of Palestine or Israel?

This poll will close on Apr 20, 2059 at 5:51 AM.
  1. Palestine

    60 vote(s)
    43.2%
  2. Israel

    39 vote(s)
    28.1%
  3. Neither

    16 vote(s)
    11.5%
  4. Both

    24 vote(s)
    17.3%
  1. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    Maybe because Palestine is a Greek word that was already in use in the 5th Century BC. And in case that Hasbara Buckfast has addled your mind to the point of complete obliteration - the 5th Century BC is before 1948 AD. Of course, the Phoenicians were a great civilization in Palestine long before the Hebrew nomadic goat herders had migrated from North Africa.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
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  2. kalipa44

    kalipa44 Member Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    Who the hell is "Yanki" ?


    They Say:
    "The Palestinians are not a real people. They are just Arabs from other places who settled in the Land of Israel over the years, without any cohesive national identity. There never was a Palestinian state and efforts to create one now are unjustified."

    We Say:
    "Golda Meir’s suggestion, back in the late 1960s, that there is no Palestinian people was wrong and counterproductive. Repeating it today is wrong many times over, and does a terrible disservice to efforts to secure Israel's future through peace.

    The starting point is this: it makes no difference whether Israelis, or Jews, or anyone else recognize the Palestinians as a people. The Palestinians view themselves as a distinct people, with deep ties to the land between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea. Israel and supporters of Israel can neither deny nor wish the Palestinians and their claims out of existence. That is the reality that must be accepted and addressed if there is ever going to be peace, security, and stability.

    At the same time, Israelis and Jews should recognize the gross insincerity and disrespect involved in denying the Palestinians' identity, because we have experienced the same ugly denial. For years, extremists within and outside the Arab world have attacked the legitimacy of Israel as a state by attacking the Jewish claim to the land and attacking the legitimacy of Israelis as a national group. They have argued that Israelis are nothing but foreigners who came from the West, who should go back where they came from.

    People of integrity - Jewish and non-Jewish - categorically reject and condemn such attacks on Israel. We point to Jewish historical and religious ties to the land, to the continual presence of Jews on the land throughout history, and to the well-established Jewish longing for Israel way before 1948. We insist on Israelis' right to self-determination and security. And we recognize the pain such attacks cause to Israelis and the threat these attacks represent to the very possibility of Israel-Arab peace.

    Likewise, for decades there has been an effort among extremists in Israel and abroad to try to delegitimize the Palestinians as a people and delegitimize their right, as a people, to self-determination. These arguments are historically incorrect and insensitive. Worse, they are irrelevant to the current situation on the ground, and politically damaging to Israeli interests.

    There is ample historical documentation showing that a separate local identity among Arabs living in Palestine started forming in the 16th and 17th century, and that a national Palestinian consciousness began crystallizing early in the 20th century, as anti-colonial movements took root around the world. This national consciousness transformed into a national movement and later into a national liberation movement, in large part as a result of the friction between the Palestinians and Zionism, the Jewish national self-determination movement."

    Americans for Peace Now
     
  3. Setantawatchl

    Setantawatchl Member

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    Make up your mind
    This is an argument for a two state solution and younappear tomsupport that.
    What the Americans for peace are arguing is what most liberal.people argue for. It' what Israelis and I believe Palestinians want in the main. The argument is against extremists, people like you and Tadhg people who are in the minority.
    Are you now coming back to the middle if so you'e very welcome.
     
  4. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    The ZioNazis have no intention of ever supporting any two state solution. They use this nonsense only to keep the political landscape frozen - and themselves in command of it. The sooner the Palestinians give up this nonsense and fight a straight campaign for one man one vote within the Israeli state - the sooner this will all be over.
     
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  5. Anglophile

    Anglophile Respected Member Political Irish

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    [​IMG]
     
  6. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    Your Hasbara handlers are taking the shit out of you again, you Buckfast drunken Muppet.
     
  7. Setantawatchl

    Setantawatchl Member

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    You're totally confused now Throbby
    Every citizen of Israel has a vote
    Come on Throbby (what would Leo say?)
     
  8. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    [​IMG]


    Not everybody under Zionist rule has a vote to the Zionist parliament. Time to end the Apartheid. One man one vote! One woman one vote!
     
  9. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    [​IMG]

    One man \woman one Vote!
     
  10. Setantawatchl

    Setantawatchl Member

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    We need to get the refugees out of Mosney and other centres and get them the vote. In fact if we were streamline the arrival to vote leadtime Ireland would be a very popular country to come to.
    Let's make it happen
    Throbby could you make up one of your memes to kick off the campaign
     
  11. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    Keep on topic. We're talking about ending Apartheid in Israel. Give a vote to everyone ruled by the Israeli parliament. Don't be afraid of democracy. Equal voting rights for all!
     
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  12. Setantawatchl

    Setantawatchl Member

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    We're in agreement Israeli citizens should have and have all got the vote.
    We should take note and fast track voting rights for the new Irish. We have seen the benefits of people from other nationalities coming to our shores and I know you'll agree with me that Leo is a fine example and a role model. You'll be pushing an open door with Leo.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  13. Plasticpaddy

    Plasticpaddy Member Political Irish

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    All decent people want others to have justice and to be treated fairly.The trouble is it gets very complicated and there are so many fanatics on all sides that can't be trusted.
     
  14. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    All residents of the West Bank and Gaza must have Israeli citizenship and equal voting rights to all other Israeli citizens. Since they are ruled by Israel, they must have equal rights in the Israeli parliament. End Apartheid now!
     
  15. Setantawatchl

    Setantawatchl Member

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    That's a new departure
    So you believe that the Israeli parliament is legitimate, then that makes you a Zionist
    Whoda thunk
     
  16. Anglophile

    Anglophile Respected Member Political Irish

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    If you have a rough life but blame other people for it all the time, you probably deserve it.

    Real men make changes - they don't whine about how tough things are.:smiley:

    The real reason many "Palestinians" don't drag themselves out of their self made gutter.

    It's easier to blame the joooz....like Tadhg and Co.:cool:
     
  17. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    I think it's a de facto state of affairs and there should be equal rights for all. End Apartheid now!
     
  18. Tadhg Gaelach

    Tadhg Gaelach Legend Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    Daughter of Anglocrap is following in the footstep of her old fool.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. kalipa44

    kalipa44 Member Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    "Real men " :p:D:D LIke you ???:D
    Real men are honest and don't lie to protect a corrupt and vicious regime.

    The reason Palestinians cannot progress is the Israeli Occupation of their country and their lives.
    Almost 60 years of a savage and belligerent occupation has failed to get rid of them which was Israel's plan but ie has taken it's toll.

    The theft of their lands and livelihoods has brought poverty on them , while the Illegal squatters who enjoy the stolen land and resources thrive with massive funding and protection of the same Israeli Occupation.
    That is Apartheid.

    The Knesset voting though a Death Penalty for Palestinians but not Israelis.
    That is apartheid
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2018 at 1:51 PM
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  20. kalipa44

    kalipa44 Member Donator Battle Royale Political Irish

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    Gaza is being crippled by blockades’ Simon Coveney, Irish Minister for Foreign Affairs and Tanaiste, delivers a strong message to the people of Palestine and Gaza that they are not forgotten.

    Simon Coveney: 'Gaza is slightly smaller than County Louth but nearly 2 million people live in it'

    While in Gaza I saw the pressures on food, water and electricity, writes Tánaiste Simon Coveney.


    HE LAST TIME I was in Gaza was 2004. I was a Fine Gael TD and made a low-key entry into the strip with colleagues Liz O’Donnell and Senator David Norris through the Erez crossing from Israel.
    We spent two nights there and my lasting impressions were of a place challenged by significant overcrowding and tragic living conditions, a population locked in by security fences that prevented movement in and out, full of young people intensely frustrated at not being allowed to help themselves.
    This week I entered Gaza as Ireland’s Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs in an armoured Jeep under UN escort.
    The first difference hit me right at the border. Erez is no longer a secure checkpoint but a fortified border terminal. Since I was last in Gaza there have been three wars and in the most recent in 2014, 495 children died.
    [​IMG]Erez crossing (File photo from 2015)

    ‘Gaza is being crippled by blockades’
    The strip has been crippled by the Israeli and Egyptian blockades and youth unemployment is over 65%. In Gaza 1.3 of the 1.9 million people now rely on food relief and Ireland is proud to stand with United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) in providing food, healthcare and education
    The strip is slightly smaller than County Louth but has nearly 2 million people living in it. It is one of the most densely populated places on earth and is barricaded by a large security wall.
    On its sunny shoreline you can stare at the horizon across the blue Mediterranean, but Gaza’s 1,300 fishing boats are only allowed venture five nautical miles before they are turned back by warning shots.

    Nobody envisaged UNRWA’s work lasting 70-years but its thousands of workers are still in the region because of the failure to secure and guarantee a lasting peace.
    Appeal to the US
    UNRWAs funding is currently under threat, I committed €4 million of Irish money for 2018 this week, but have also appealed to the US administration directly not to reduce funding to this essential agency at such a sensitive time.
    A major report has predicted Gaza will be unlivable by 2020. It was obvious to me on the ground this week that the situation is unsustainable and unacceptable. Gaza is about to implode under the strain of multiple socio-environmental challenges and we are running out of time to prevent it.
    All this will most likely lead to a new cycle of violence and a repeat of past atrocities. Everyone I spoke to recognises the urgency of new actions in Gaza.
    I spoke about Gaza with both the Israeli Prime-Minister and Palestinian President on Wednesday and have committed Ireland to funding and supporting new projects focused on improving quality of life and hope for the future.

    On the need for a broader peace process, which ultimately is the only solution, I hope both leaders will lead their people into fresh peace talks leading to a long overdue two-state solution with Jerusalem as a shared capital. There are many sceptics, with good reason, but I do believe a fair negotiated peace agreement is possible.
    Palestinian right to have their own State
    Israel has legitimate security concerns that need to be addressed and Ireland recognises that. However Palestinians also have a legitimate ambition to have their own State which Ireland continues to support.
    Hamas has controlled Gaza for more than a decade and is classed as a terrorist organisation by the EU. We do not deal directly with Hamas and condemn their violence.

    However we support the renewed efforts for reconciliation of Palestinian factions as the people of Gaza have suffered badly from this internal division. One government structure for both the West Bank and Gaza is essential for the creation of a future functioning State.
    While in Gaza I saw the pressures on food, water and electricity. I also saw reasons to be very hopeful.
    The land is fertile, a natural gas find at sea could be harvested, a viable commercial port could allow the region to trade in the absence of a blockade, water desalination plants will turn seawater into drinking water and the EU is funding one to be constructed. Most of all Gaza’s youth are smart and well educated.

    There’s an old Chinese proverb that has been adopted by the development community: “Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.”
    One of the UN staff added to it in Gaza, “The people of Gaza don’t need your fish or to be taught how to fish, they are well educated with plenty of their own resources. What the people of Gaza need is access to the sea and the outside world and they’ll determine their own future”.
    My 2004 visit was 14-years ago next week. The tensions, frustration and danger I saw then are at boiling point now. It is time for the international community to act to save Gaza, to give young people hope for the future, before despair and extremism fill that void – something ISIS and other extremist groups are only too eager to fill.
    That is why I’ve traveled to the region twice in the last five months. Ireland will liaise with our EU partners and the European Commission in the coming weeks to show the people of Palestine and Gaza that they are not forgotten.
    Simon Coveney is Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs
    .

    Simon Coveney: 'Gaza is slightly smaller than County Louth but nearly 2 million people live in it'
     
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